finalize or withdraw? Alex Shinn (19 Aug 2005 04:24 UTC)
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Re: finalize or withdraw?
Thomas Bushnell BSG
(19 Aug 2005 05:18 UTC)
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Re: finalize or withdraw?
Alex Shinn
(19 Aug 2005 05:21 UTC)
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Re: finalize or withdraw?
Hans Oesterholt-Dijkema
(19 Aug 2005 07:57 UTC)
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Re: finalize or withdraw?
Hans Oesterholt-Dijkema
(19 Aug 2005 07:57 UTC)
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Re: finalize or withdraw?
Michael Sperber
(20 Aug 2005 06:54 UTC)
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Re: finalize or withdraw?
Alex Shinn
(22 Aug 2005 04:17 UTC)
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Re: finalize or withdraw?
Michael Sperber
(22 Aug 2005 16:06 UTC)
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Re: finalize or withdraw?
Per Bothner
(22 Aug 2005 18:04 UTC)
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Re: finalize or withdraw?
Michael Sperber
(23 Aug 2005 07:19 UTC)
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Re: finalize or withdraw?
Per Bothner
(23 Aug 2005 07:59 UTC)
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Re: finalize or withdraw?
Michael Sperber
(23 Aug 2005 08:14 UTC)
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Re: finalize or withdraw?
Per Bothner
(24 Aug 2005 04:07 UTC)
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Re: finalize or withdraw?
Michael Sperber
(24 Aug 2005 17:30 UTC)
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Re: finalize or withdraw?
Alex Shinn
(24 Aug 2005 02:57 UTC)
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Re: finalize or withdraw?
Alex Shinn
(23 Aug 2005 01:27 UTC)
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Re: finalize or withdraw?
Michael Sperber
(23 Aug 2005 07:21 UTC)
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Re: finalize or withdraw?
Alex Shinn
(23 Aug 2005 08:10 UTC)
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Discussion has settled down and there haven't been many changes recently, so it's getting time to give SRFI-56 the thumbs up or thumbs down, but I'm still unhappy with some things. The library procedures provide a decent set of primitives for single numeric values. Other common binary I/O idioms are records and tables of numeric values, and although they would be more efficient with their own primitives, can at least be easily implemented in SRFI-56. The library style of reading and writing single different sized numbers at a time is especially well suited to such applications as writing a portable assembler. However, an assembler invariably needs to read and write strings within the binary data, and SRFI-56 provides no portable means to do this. There are several ways to handle this inevitable mixing of binary data and text: * separate procedures to write text to binary ports - something like read/write-utf8-string - Java takes this approach letting you read and write UTF-8 characters to binary ports. - a complete API would need to handle all encodings. * procedures to convert strings to and from srfi-4 uvectors or blobs * separate mixed binary+text ports - open-binary-and-character-input-file - wouldn't have guarantees about buffering efficiency * layered ports - open a character port on top of a binary port, read/write a value, close the character port then continue using the binary port - flexible but more than we need for simple assembler-type cases Without something like this it is simply impossible to write a portable assembler. In fact, the vast majority of binary formats include some form of text. If finalized as is, I'm hard pressed to think what SRFI-56 would make portably possible that wasn't before. I have three options at this point. Finalize SRFI-56, and hope for future extensions to sort out the mixed I/O mess. In the meantime, implementations which support mixed I/O natively would probably just do so, leaving Java and C wchar based implementations in the cold. Alternately I could add another quick patch. The simplest solution is to provide char->ucs and ucs->char procedures to convert between characters and their Unicode code-point values. This would make code that needed ASCII text in binary files trivial to support, and full Unicode could be supported by implementing your own read/write-utf8-string or read-utf8-into-u8vector! or similar. The truly ambitious could implement their own encoding routines on top of this, so at this point we do have full portability. Convenience encoding routines could be added in separate SRFIs. Or, finally, I could simply withdraw the SRFI and considering writing up a new one. Character I/O can't properly be handled without addressing encodings, and the specification of what an encoding is (string, symbol or object?) and what forms and names it takes is probably sufficient for its own SRFI. Another missing crucial feature for even minimal binary I/O is random access, without which one can't even implement a (meaningful) b-tree. At this point there would be too many changes to band-aid onto the already long overdraft SRFI-56. Minimality was a major goal, but has SRFI-56 fallen short of usefulness? I've been using a SRFI-56-like library for many, many projects, but on checking, every single one of them freely mixes binary and character I/O. -- Alex